Post by technoendo » Sun Jan 25, am. Post by TravisK » Tue Feb 03, am. Post by Joseph S. Post by TravisK » Mon Apr 06, pm. Post by Hadar » Wed Jan 13, pm. Post by TravisK » Mon Jan 18, pm. Post by technoendo » Tue Feb 23, am. Quick links. Dedicated exclusively to field herping.
Post by technoendo » Sun Dec 14, pm Hello! This is my first post here. I saw one of the "Herping With Dylan" videos on youtube where Dylan picked up and photographed a snake which met some IL legal definition of "collection" and he said he had to pay a fine. I would like to better understand the law around this and avoid getting in trouble.
What is the place you guys go to learn about this stuff? Up till now I've been avoiding private land, indian reservations, and mostly looking for snakes on public hiking trails. My hope is to go out on more herping trips in and I would hate to be in violation of any laws due to my ignorance. I'm wondering if our laws up here are fairly relaxed? I can't seem to find folks talking about them even on this forum or maybe I'm just bad at searching.
Can anyone help educate me on any northwest herping related laws or point me at some resources where I could learn more? Zonata cali mountain king is the only protected snake in WA. I once found one as a kid on the Oregon side of the Columbia River outside the city of Hood River, and I expect this means I should give up on any dreams of ever looking for these guys in the wild again unless I was allowed to join some Department of Fish and Wildlife folks who seem to have the authority.
I can accept this though as I do understand how rare and special they are in their WA range. For years I have hiked along trails while carrying a snake hook in case of large gopher snakes and upon reading this makes me think I probably could have gotten in trouble for carrying "tools of collection".
Do folks on this forum file for scientific collection permits? I guess the short summary for WA is that its technically illegal to even handle a garter snake, especially protected species like Zonata, especially on federal land and state parks.
Outside of this on places like private property with permission of the owner there may be some grey areas where the state is unlikely to enforce, but the WFWD has the authority over wildlife and seems they could if they had enough reason maybe. Is it best not to carry snake hooks on the trails in WA?
Is that pretty much what folks here do? I guess its just photos from a distance although that sounds difficult for identifications and quality of content. I've been in the pacific northwest for 3 decades oblivious to this law and have infrequently been in violation of it. This makes me sad that the law sees me as a poacher and I'm not used to having a restraining order from wild snakes. I'm not collecting anything but I do admit that it probably is harassment.
At least I've learned a bit more about the law today and can stay out of trouble. Hoyer » Mon Dec 15, am technoendo: I am a graduate in Fisheries and Wildlife OSU '55' and without any reservations, will state that whomever crafted the Washington Regulations dealing with wildlife being off limits to the public is or are grossly incompetent. Oregon's wildlife agency has it shortcomings as well but nowhere as reactionary as is the case with the state of Washington. If you have a scientific collecting permit in Washington, handling wildlife I assume would not be considered as harassment and producing harm to the specimens or its population.
But without such a permit, to handle the same wildlife would be considered as harassment and thus potentially producing harm.
To make the Washington Wildlife agency and Commission appear even more incompetent, the agency and commission condone and even promote the harvest killing of thousands of game and commercial species.
How such individual can justify the above yet claim that handling wildlife is harassment is simply mind boggling. It has been my experience that you can often accuse governmental agencies of being rational. On a different note, that you mention once observing a Lampropetis zonata outside of Hood River is of special interest.
To my knowledge, the species has never been officially documented on the Oregon side of the Columbia, only in southwestern Oregon. I am going to pass your observation on to Alan St. John of Bend, Oregon. Alan has published a field guide of reptiles of the Northwestern U. Richard F. Hoyer Corvallis, Oregon. Post by technoendo » Tue Dec 16, am Richard, Thank you for the reply sir. Can you speak on the laws in Oregon? I live up in the Seattle area and was thinking of a summer herping trip in central OR and still haven't found details on their herp laws and am wondering if they are as restrictive as WA.
I did notice that Zonata california mountain kingsnake , common kingsnakes, sharp-tailed snakes, and western groundsnakes are protected in OR. Is that true? I don't see any harm in trying to apply as if I get rejected it won't be a problem for me to follow the law.
Education and public awareness related efforts would be the justifications I could support when applying for that science collections permit. I hope you don't think of me as a "hater" cause that is certainly not how I want to come across.
I am just very concerned about what seems to be an ever increasing upward spiral in venomous snake bites inflicted on people who are handling them in one way or another. This impacts upon us all in a very negative way. Unfortunatly, I think that an awful lot of these bites are the result of people doing things with snakes that they have no buisness doing which certainly includes routinly touching the animals with their hands.
Every time you put your hand in contact with that animal your chances of getting bit skyrocket. And it is, in the vast majority of cases, just needless risk. So, why do it? I think that a great deal of the reason is that people who don't have enough knowlodge to know better, do it because they see someone else do it on TV. Raymond Ditmars warned us about this in the way back when he protested I think in Snakes of North America against demonstrating too much familiarity with venomous snakes to lecture groups and I think he has been amply proved correct.
People tend to mimic what they see and if they see unsafe handling practices they repeat them, and we all pay for it when the inevitable happens. I've collected or handled hundreds of wild venomous snakes over the last 30 years and I have lain hands on none of them. It just isnt necessary. Dylan on Wow, I was kinda surprised when someone told me I was on the front page of some herp website.
I have never been to this site before That being said, I am not going to get into justifying why I did "this" or "that". I do enjoy reading what people have to say about this kind of stuff though, negative or positive. I have several videos on youtube and people always seem to focus on the venomous ones. I guess that is a bit more exciting. Personally I find the non-venomous stuff more exciting. I have lots of experience with this stuff about 15 years..
Accidents happen. I refrain from handling hots as much as possible. Especially if they show any signs of aggression. If they strike, I keep my distance. The point of the videos is not to be "badass" or be "that guy who handles venomous snakes".. These videos were not made for "Herp Enthusiasts", they all already know the plight that reptiles are facing. These videos were for a general audience.
I don't know what else to say. I can't make people change their opinions about the videos. Haters will be haters I guess. Israel is a country with the advantage of hosting a large number of species on a small area.
It is ideal for short herpetological trips. And the country is home to several mythical species… So here we are on the road for a short journey of a week! It was obviously a must for the association… The Komodo Islands are simply mythical for any reptile lover … Who did not grow up looking in the books or in front of the TV the incredible Komodo dragons? We come back after 3 intense weeks. We already knew this beautiful territory because we had already observed many species in Mexico is the paradise of Reptiles.
It is the country where live the most reptiles species in the world. Sooner or later, Atheris had to come here! Here we are, for the fourth year in a row, visiting Morocco. This country is a paradise for reptile fans! As every year, our friend Abdou has joined us. We are accompanied by Dylan , Miguel , Marion and Jean, four members of the association, who we hope will not be disappointed with the trip!
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